This post originated from an RSS feed registered with Ruby Buzz
by David Heinemeier Hansson.
Original Post: Why Web Programming Matters Most
Feed Title: Loud Thinking
Feed URL: http://feeds.feedburner.com/LoudThinking
Feed Description: All about the full-stack, web-framework Rails for Ruby and on putting it to good effect with Basecamp
Ian Bicking has issued a call to arms for the Python community under the banner of Why Web Programming Matters Most. In the piece, he expresses his frustration with web programming not being more in the center for Python and longs for the growth curve of PHP.
A fellow Python programmer, Jonathan LaCour, responded with his opinion that Rails should be the model for how to turn Python into a relevant force in web programming and prevent that "...Rails will be the dominate open source, dynamic web framework for the next few years at least":
I don't even like Ruby very much, but Rails is obviously the best web framework out there because of the tightly integrated simplicity of it! Rails is the Apple of web frameworks — one tightly controlled stack. Sure, you may lose some flexibility, but you gain beauty, simplicity, and ease of use! I really really wanted to pick Python, but I just couldn't do it. There are too many frameworks, none of which are as good as Rails.
Jonathan further argues the damage of excessive choice and the prevalence of Not Invented Here syndrome in the Python web world. As a tangent to this discussion, I highly recommend listening to Barry Schwartz's excellent talk on The Paradox of Choice: Why More Is Less from Pop!Tech 2004.
In short, indistinguishable choices (or just too many) leads to lower satisfaction with the eventual pick and increases the chances that no pick will be made at all. The latter seeming to be exactly what Jonathan describes by being overwhelmed with choice of Python web frameworks and then picking an entirely different language altogether.
Unfortunately, it seems that there is little faith in resolving the situation of choice overload. Glyph Lefkowitz describes it as:
I can understand being frustrated with the proliferation of web frameworks, but let's face it: there is no way you are going to be able to convince anyone to give up on their pet framework to work on someone else's.
I see a lot of people in the Python web community complaining about proliferation of frameworks. I don't see anyone at all standing up and saying "My web framework X is unnecessary, I will abandon it and spend my web-framework development time working on web framework Y instead."
So there's a a somewhat shared understanding of what the problem is (too many, too similar frameworks of varying quality), a somewhat shared sense of a possible solution (combine efforts to get fewer, but stronger choices), but no will for the sacrifice or cooperation needed to make it happen.
Jonathan compares this situation of unsatisfactory choice with what we're doing in Ruby:
In the Ruby world, if you are developing a web application, there is no choice: there is Rails. And thats okay, since its so damn well done. In the Python world, if a web framework doesn't do something that you want, you just create your own framework... why not fix the original one? The whole situation is embarrassing.
Of course this is an oversimplification. There are quite a few other Ruby solutions for how to deal with the web problem. And new ones still appear, like the recent introduction of Wee (a Seaside-inspired framework in Ruby).
That being said, I strongly believe that there's a big benefit in having a dominant framework draw a strong profile for a small language. The amount of positive attention Rails has been able to shine on Ruby for a long time has made me particularly proud. Languages need blockbuster hits like that to establish their authority in the public perception for a given domain.
I'll continue to do my earnest in order for Rails to stay deserving of this honorable role for Ruby. The growing community around Rails is intent on doing the same. We're just pushing ~30,000 downloads now (through gems, across all versions) and are aiming to get that into the hundreds by year end.
I wish the Pythonists all the luck in finding their own formula for raising the attention of Python as a web language. Just as I welcome Pythonists that would like to give Rails a try while waiting for the former to happen.
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